Saturday, February 21, 2009

Is socialism bad? If so, why?

With the election of Barack Obama and the implementation of his policies to shore up the worsening economy, I’ve heard a lot of people throw around the word “socialism.” I will freely admit that I do not understand economics; I have little education on the subject, just enough to know that it’s incredibly complex and that there are a lot of people who are way smarter than I am who still don’t understand what’s going on. So I ask these two questions in complete seriousness:

What exactly is socialism?
Why is it such a horrible thing?

People typically say things like, “Socialism will make us like France”, or worse, “Like Soviet Russia!” without really explaining these statements. Getting beyond the political ramifications of a socialist agenda, does it really make for bad economic policy? Should I expect my children or grandchildren to be standing in bread lines and buying Levis on the black market because of Obama’s alleged socialist agenda?

5 comments:

Anonymous said...

Why do you think the Peppermint Gorilla moved Ann and clan to this land? Socialism.

Rutro76 said...

Socialism is most easily boiled down to income redistribution. Essentially, we all work and the fruit of our labor is shared between all of the workers. This is great in theory, but we are not theoretical people--we are real people. We need to be motivated to work by more than the greater good. When the incentive to work is removed, people do not work as hard as if their paycheck depended on it.

The reason that Obama's administration is being described as socialist is because his programs provide money and services to an ever widening group of non-taxpayers at the expense of the "wealthy". It dangerous for a lot of reasons, but the big one is that it rewards those who don't work and punishes those who do.

To take a religious swing at it, it would appear that socialism sounds more christian--kind of like the early church a la Acts. The reality is that christian nations tend toward capitalism because we understand that people are sinful and lazy. We are not going to work for the greater good; we are going to work for our personal good. The goal should be to have us share with those in need rather than pay the government to meet those needs.

Anonymous said...

For starters, I'll offer a quote that I think sums up the problem best:
The problem with socialism is that you eventually, run out of other people's money. - Margaret Thatcher.

When you have unrestricted access to consume "other people's" resources or property, there is no motivational inhibits to make you sheperd the resource. Individuals will always act in self interest, but if the system they are operating within fails to harness this truth of human existance, then the result is aptly demonstrated by every single attempt at socialism or communism that has thus existed on the planet. Most have failed catastrophically. Those that have endured have failed to achieve the stated goals of socialism: ending poverty, shared and growing prosperity, etc. And arguably they have only managed to persist in existance because they have not fully embraced socialism, instead marrying a mix of socialism and capitalistic policies.

Rutro76's explanation is a good one. I agree that Socialism can be argued as seemingly more "moralistic". The problem of course is that it fails to account for real human motivations and behavior, and by disencouraging work and effort, it dooms itself to a downward spiral. Usually it also results in a form of oligarchy (a form of dictatorship under a group of leaders/decision makers), which in the long run always harms human freedom and prosperity.

I personally find socialism to be repugnant. A lofty idea which in practice is a killer of souls, and usually lives as well. If man were something other than what we are, perhaps it would be a wonderful system. But like with spaceflight, where we can ignore the laws of physics at our peril, in governments and economics, ignoring the laws of human nature and reality are just as perilous.

Look at the current housing 'crisis'. By bailing out those who borrowed above their means, the government has actually punished and reduced the incentives for both renters and for those who borrowed within their means and pay their mortgages on time each month. Now those of us who lived in our means are getting to help pay for those who didn't. And that's fair, how?

Some more fodder for your persual:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticisms_of_socialism

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/10/the_repugnance_of_socialism.html

http://denbeste.nu/external/Peters01.html

http://denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2003/10/TheTragedyoftheCommons.shtml

http://www.denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2004/06/AletterfromSingapore.shtml

I'll dig up more if you want. Plenty of interesting articles on the topic to be found.

And L4D was awesomesauce, even if I kept getting killed by tanks or tank-related horrors. We'll have to do it again.

Anonymous said...

We were just talking about a Scripture recently in my New Testament 2 class on:

2 Thessalonians 3:6-10.

6In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching[a] you received from us. 7For you yourselves know how you ought to follow our example. We were not idle when we were with you, 8nor did we eat anyone's food without paying for it. On the contrary, we worked night and day, laboring and toiling so that we would not be a burden to any of you. 9We did this, not because we do not have the right to such help, but in order to make ourselves a model for you to follow. 10For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: "If a man will not work, he shall not eat."

Notice the last line. We talked about this and it is not talking about those who cannot work, but for those who are unwilling to work. I cannot say that the whole system is bad, but there are too many people out there that are capable of working but are unwilling because they are already getting taken care of. Socialism makes it possible for some to be unwilling to work at the expense of those who do. It may sound scriptural, but it has been addressed. Help those who cannot help themselves, but if you are unwilling to work then you don't eat.

Anonymous said...

"... If any will not work, neither let him eat." 2 Thessalonians 3:10

I personally think the Church should flesh out the Word and take care of the poor, etc. I don't think it's the current administration’s responsibility (or any other) to widen the gap and create more of a dependence on social programming.

Let’s be simple – if you’d like to eat and provide for your family, then work for it and don’t rely on my hard-earned tax dollars to take care of you and your family.

With that being said, there are certainly cases where social programming helps - let's just not take it to an extreme degree.